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June 15, 2006


tears again, MB...
the memories and the new wounds are deep

we thought this could never happen again

Some more numbers: 2,595 killed in the World Trade Center (2,986 among the WTC, Pentagon, and four hijacked planes). Soon the war will have visited on us again the number of American deaths that day. As I wrote elsewhere, "Someday we will just read names, every hour of every of every week. Someday we will not read names anymore."

MB, these are Iraq casualties, correct? Why did you decide not to read Afghanistan casualties?

We wanted to keep our reading completely focused on Iraq. Snow's outrageous "It's a number" comment cemented our feelings on that. We could have added the other dead members of the "Coalition," the journalists and contractors who have been killed and the Afghan toll as well, but chose not to.

It's a number that will reach the casualty level of Vietnam about the end of this century- and a far smaller number than we've lost after being involved for this long in almost every war we've fought.

Listing the names, as you do above, is a dishonest stunt designed to create the opposite impression- and a profound abuse of those names.

Bob Waters, one death is too many in a war built on lies. I am sure the kin and friends of the 2500 will be comforted by your conclusion that the tally is small potatoes compared with some previous wars.


Bob Waters and perhaps others on the right agree that Snow's statement was "idiotic." But, he says "Those blogs and newscasts which list the names, hometowns, and sometimes pictures of the dead are dishonestly trying to leave the impression that the war has been a great deal more costly than it has." Obviously, the names reflect exactly the number who have died. Obviously, showing only a handful of their pictures understates the loss. Obviously, the war has been even more costly than can be measured in those lives. Obviously, the loss of those lives can never be measured. And not seeing them doesn't make them not exist.

These right-wing rantings are the sound of reality colliding with carefully crafted delusion.

Thanks MB.
These soldiers did not die in a war, they died in an occupation.

Bob Waters:

Note that MB pointed to the rather rapid escalation of deaths in Vietnam - if the death rate there had continued at the same rate it was going up to 1966, it would have taken some time longer to reach the number it did ultimately reach. In other words, the soldiers of this country, their families and friends, and the rest of us may be lucky enough to avoid Iraq truly becoming another Vietnam as far as casualty levels. But that's not inevitable. And it doesn't diminish the shame of this war.

Bob Waters, how dare you accuse MB of "abusing" the names.
Bush's occupation has destabilized the entire Middle East. Our troops are now a ping pong ball between various subgroups of Sunni, Shiia, and Kurds in Iraq. They are also a pinball for Iran, Russia, Turkey and the rest of the Middle East. They have no mission. They have no objectives. They are targets. Every day they are there, they lose combat effectiveness. The whole thing is a complete adulteration of their training and the Powell Doctrine. Bob, we're paying for both sides. Our tax dollars pay for our side. Our oil purchases pay for their side, all of them.
Read Sara's post about U.S. occupations, the Hunt Plan, and George C. Marshall, before you make another embarrassing comment.

Thanks for doing this, MB.

Scrolling through the names of the dead was eerily similar to a visit I made to the memorial in DC a few years back. Behind every name are grieving spouses and family members, and children who will miss a parent for the rest of their days.


Bob Waters doesn't understand that every death is woefully specific for those who are left to grieve. For people like him, this war is just a number.

One of the reasons there are not 5000 or more deaths in the Iraq War at this point is the advances in armor and medical technology, plus evacuation techniques, that allow many thousands to survive who would have died in earlier wars. There are over 10,000 with very serious injuries, particularly those with head wounds and amputees. I completely fail to see how publicly but decorously reading the names of the dead can ever be disrespectlful. What disrepects the dead is to forget them, to push them out of sight and out of mind, and to continue the fruitless cause in which they died.

The only murderers are you sick hypocritical liberals. You didn't care about the Iraqis when Saddam was murdering them and you don't care about them or the soldiers now. All you want is to make sure that the violence you see on tv is done by people with darker skin, so you can pretend it doesn't affect you.

You're responsible because you make genocide and terrorism possible. You're the enemy and when "the war" gets here, we'll make sure that people remember who is responsible. Pick out a nice lamp post.

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